Careers
Ex-Associate Hit with ‘Wave of Negativity’ at Session for Jobless
Posted May 1, 2009 5:51 AM CST
By Debra Cassens Weiss
Legal recruiters in Los Angeles told a standing-room only crowd of jobless lawyers at a panel discussion on Wednesday that they might have to look outside the law for jobs.
The dismal news had lawyers dressed in interview suits heading for the exits rather than staying to chat with the legal recruiters, the Daily Journal reports (sub. req.).
The “repeated theme of the evening” was that lawyers should look outside the law for jobs—perhaps as paralegal instructors or in human resources departments. Other options: move to the Midwest, where some midsize law firms are still hiring, or try going solo.
A former associate at Manatt, Phelps & Phillips explained why he didn’t stick around after the program. "I really don't feel like networking right now after I was just hit with this wave of negativity," he told the Daily Journal.
His friend, a co-worker also laid off from Manatt, said she already had plans for a new career. "I guess it's time to wipe the slate clean and try something new," she told the publication.
Other lawyers at the event may be considering similar options. When one panelist asked the unemployed lawyers whether they had really enjoyed practicing law, only a few raised their hands in response.
- How B of A’s GC Got Fired: Leave Now, and Leave Your BlackBerry Behind
- Schools Ranked by 'Super Lawyers' Produced
- Law Firm Price Wars Break Out as Some Try ‘Loss Leader’ Bids for Work
- Five Questions for Law Firms Abandoning Lockstep Compensation
- Judge Jails 2 Attorneys for Contempt in 4 Days
- Reed Smith Will Ask Nonequity Partners to Pony Up Possibly 15% of Pay
- Court Deputy Ordered to Apologize or Face Jail After Taking Lawyer's Paperwork
- Skadden Jumps on the Bonus Bandwagon
- ABA Executive Director Resigns
- Nasty Attitude to Co-Worker, Naughty Word in E-Mail Cost 2 Their Jobs
Should Supreme Court Justices Be Able to Review News Accounts Before Publication?
Comments
Participant
May 1, 2009 6:18 AM CST
“only a few raised their hands in response.”
That’s like asking a group of recent unilateral amputees: “Now how many of you really LIKED that other leg?”
Flag this comment
TN
May 1, 2009 6:58 AM CST
Oh look, another ABA article claiming about JD looking for work outside the legal field. Again, unless one is going to practice law, a JD is a waste of a degree for someone to pay for themselves. I am not saying that getting the actual degree is not intellectually stimulating, if I admit that studying the law is interesting.
but unless someone else is paying for your degree, it is dumb to shell out the money for one. Contrary to a commenter yesterday, companies don’t care about JDs for non-legal jobs.
At least these associates in this current article were able to get legal experience. They act all surprised at the negativity now but maybe they should get a clue and realize that there are thousands of law grads every year with crushing debt that don’t get much opportunity for any legal experience.
The ABA should be discouraging people from going to law school, so that the overabundance of law grads will slowly dissipate.
Flag this comment
B. McLeod
May 1, 2009 7:42 AM CST
What was the room capacity? It’s not too late for that military option. Sounds like there may be enough to form their own brigade. “The Lawyer Brigade.” Has a nice ring to it.
Flag this comment
Joe
May 1, 2009 9:27 AM CST
It is not so much, did you enjoy your first years as a grunt associate. It is that the law schools tell everyone when your forking out 100k+ for an education that you will all make 160k as a 1st year, knowing full well that most will not. Now some of the ones that made it to the big firm are being told leave the law. Well, that big firm pay will be hard to replace “outside” big firms.
How do you pay CA/NY law school tuition debt on midwest or small firm salaries today? You could do it a few years back, but he school tuition has exploded. How many are 40k+/year now? That is 60k+/year when you add in living in NYC/LA/DC - almost 200k debt without counting undergrad.
The worst part is with down economy law school applications are up again, on the basis of “you will get a big firm salary in a few years”. Good Luck if your not Ivy League or a top NYC/DC/Chicago school!!!
Flag this comment
CJ
May 1, 2009 11:06 AM CST
These guys are having trouble becasue all they know is big law. The idea that lil ole midwest firms are itching to hire these guys simply isn’t true. They don’t have the skills or the practice areas that midsize firms really want. Also the presumption is that they’ll just ride out the economy until they can jump back to big law.
To #4
Joe, I agree with everything you say except your last sentence. While the last sentence applies if you’re looking to go big law in one of those cities, you really don’t need an ivy education to get hired in most places. I graduated from a top tier state school that is the highest ranked school in our state. Most of my classmates have jobs which run the gammet from Big law to government to small and medium size firms. I can’t think of any who have gone solo. Are some still looking? Sure. I have a job and I’m looking for something more long term. The point is the market is not always dire as one might think, but big law people need to quit thinking that they can simply slide into a position that might be a backup for them while someone else’s dream job.
Flag this comment
Law Blows Goats
May 1, 2009 11:11 AM CST
surprised the aba even published this story - of course, now they’ll go out and accredit another 47 law schools. Douchebags
Flag this comment
Enough
May 1, 2009 11:58 AM CST
#5: CJ, you are right. Columbia, for instance, doesn’t even teach NY Practice. Most in the “elite” skills are not taught concrete practical skills because most of the student, it was thought, won’t need them where they are going. I the meantime, Third and Fourth Tier schools, regional schools, have been beefing up their practical skills training, and those students will fit right into the jobs at small and mid-size firms that are remaining.
Flag this comment
CJ
May 1, 2009 12:13 PM CST
I wasn’t meaning to Bash the ivys in favor of T3 and T4 schools… far from it. Honestly I believe that private schools outside of the top 50 or so are a scam, but there’s a lot of schools in the top tier which aren’t ivy league that serve their markets very well especially markets where there isn’t an ivy league school anywhere nearby. Think of some of the big 10 state schools (Iowa, Wisconsin, Indiana, Ohio State, Minnesota). I’m not counting Illinois because Chicago is largely served by Northwestern and UC. Nor am I counting Northwestern or Michigan, as they’re on par with the Ivys themselves.
The schools I mentioned are all in the top 40 and all turn out excellent lawyers at a fraction of the cost of the ivy schools. They serve large markets abet not usually NY, Chicago, or DC (although grads from these schools likely go there).
The point is that if you look in Minneapolis or Columbus, you’re likely to find big firms staffed with lawyers from U of Minn and OSU respectively. In my own city, I know a lot of partners who don’t like to recruit at the ivy league becasue they think that they’re only interested in big firm / big markets. That’s not to say an ivy grad won’t do well here with a connection to the area, but people from NY or DC with a degree from Harvard or Yale shouldn’t necessarily think they can just land in a midwest city and land a job with a midsize firm without some kind of connection.
Flag this comment
unperson
May 1, 2009 1:33 PM CST
unless you have a successful, established lawyer in your family tree, or your family is rich, attending a TTT law school is a recipe for debt slavery and life ruination.
as for those at the ABA and state bar association who continue to facilitate the TTT law school scam, these people need to be criminally prosecuted and sued to within an inch of their lives.
Flag this comment
Alicia
May 1, 2009 2:19 PM CST
Word on the street is that recruiters are turning away laid off attorneys because they will not receive a commission on the placement if the attorney has been laid off or is otherwise unemployed. Have you guys heard this?
Flag this comment
Anonymous
May 13, 2009 6:21 AM CST
This would probably be a good time for ABA to un-do its Ethics Opinion from August 2008 allowing the exportation of thousands of legal jobs to India and other countries. Those jobs could be filled by American attorneys in this downturn. Who appointed those attorneys who wrote that Ethics Opinion? They should all be fired at once.
Flag this comment
Add a Comment
We welcome your comments, but please adhere to our comment policy.
Commenting has expired on this post.