Isn’t That Question Illegal?

AttorneyMom
Oct 2, 2008 10:47 AM CST

Just a few years ago, after several years at an organization, I applied for a promotion and was recommended strongly by the outgoing supervisor.  During the interview, conducted by several other attorneys, I was asked “how are you *feeling.”  This was an obvious comment about the fact that I was visibly pregnant at the time.  Before the decision was announced, the female supervising attorney literally walked around the office asking most of the other younger women if they were or had any plans to become pregnant in the near term.  I had every intention of returning to work full time after a short maternity leave and had already made plans to do so, yet I was passed over for the promotion.  The successful candidate had a school-aged child and had stated unequivocally she had no plans to become pregnant again or have any other children.  I subsequently left that organization as a result (as did most of the other attorneys with whom I’d worked there for years).

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Lori
Oct 2, 2008 12:48 PM CST

I have heard entirely ridiculous comments during job interviews in Virginia that started with the phrase, “We love our women associates.”  In the first instance, a partner explained to me how a female associate at their firm went into labor on the day a motion for summary judgment was due, and she brought her laptop to the hospital and finished it in between contractions.  Another firm noted how a woman had given birth to her child and returned to work the next day.  I wish I could go back in time (and not be a 3L desparate for a job) and say what I was thinking, namely “You must be crazy!”

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SS
Oct 3, 2008 3:51 AM CST

I was returning to full-time practice while raising a special needs child and amidst the illness of my former husband when the managing partner of the Houston office of a national law firm interviewed me. He quized me in person and then sent me a menopause joke. He subsequently told me that they “only hire kids” but that my resume had interestedhim and he had wanted to meet me. He said he knew I was old because he had seen my dates. He proved to want a “personal” relationship.

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LGG
Oct 3, 2008 6:44 AM CST

IN my first interview with this firm, the Managing Partner asked me if I understood that being an attorney with his firm required a time committment and then asked me if I had anyone at home that I needed to rush home to cook dinner for.  My response was that I did not cook.  I did accept a position with that firm, learned all they could teach me, and moved on in 2 years.  Despite the Managing Partner’s general character flaws, he was a very good attorney and I was able to learn from him (and the rest of the more than capable attorneys in that firm).  However I hope he also learned something and never asked that question of any other female interviewee.

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ladylawyer
Oct 3, 2008 6:48 AM CST

In the mid 1980s when applying for a summer associate position, I was asked whether I had a love interest that would cause me to move from the city. This came despite the fact that I had lived all my life in a suburb of the city, went to college in the city and to law school about one hour outside of the city.  I was also asked by a partner at another firm that year what my father did for a living.  The fact that I I was number two in my law school class was not sufficient to assure I was worthy of an offer. At that time I was shocked by these things.  Twenty plus years later I know that they were the tip of the iceberg in large law firms.

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Hadley V. Baxendale
Oct 3, 2008 6:56 AM CST

How about illegal/discriminatory questions from the clients?  It is illegal to refuse to enter into a contract with someone due to race. So the clients who require racial diversity as a condition of engagement (and the firms who acquiesce) violate that law.  W ewould never counsel a client to engage in illegal discrimiinatory conduct, but many firms participate in it.  It’s no different from a client saying, “I don’t want any girl lawyers working on this project.”

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Chris
Oct 3, 2008 7:03 AM CST

How is it illegal to refuse to enter into a K with someone because of race? This would be state specific, and how would you prove it? Furthermore, the 14th doesn’t prohibit this conduct by individuals. If I want a black lawyer, I’m entitled to have one. If I want a woman lawyer, I can have her too.

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dm
Oct 3, 2008 7:09 AM CST

As a labor & employment lawyer representing employers, these comments make me cringe.  But they are the type of stuff that gives me job security.

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LO
Oct 3, 2008 7:14 AM CST

As a first or second year associate, I remember the 50-year old managing partner questioning why his assistant and I both didn’t stay as late at the office as he did (he like to stay until 11 PM).  I had to remind him that neither his assistant (a single mother of a 4- year old whom she would bring into the office after day care closed to continue working), nor I had a “wife” who took care of the household chores, nor yet had the means to pay for someone to pick up the drycleaning, buy groceries, clean the house, etc.  I could see the light bulb go off in his head, and he never asked again. I also billed 2300 hours that year…

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Beth
Oct 3, 2008 7:53 AM CST

It was more of a rhetorical question (and the year was 1973) when the male partner in a firm about to have a female partner named to the U.S. Court of Appeals said, “our clients feel more comfortable with a male attorney, and tell us that, so why should we hire you?”

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Joy Rushing
Oct 3, 2008 8:04 AM CST

When I interviewed for jobs in 1980, when I was graduating from law school, I was asked who did the housework in our house. One attorney went on and on about having to be physically strong (I was running 3 miles several times a week). My office mate was told that you had to have brass balls to be a lawyer. A local store advertised brass balls for sale so I bought some for several of my female law school friends, just so we could really be lawyers. I still have mine.

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Jobless
Oct 3, 2008 8:36 AM CST

Last fall I interviewed for a summer associate position at a Chicago firm.  The partner drilled me on whether my mom stayed at home with me or worked during my childhood.  Then the partner asked me if I’m going to quit working when I have kids.  I was so shocked that I hesitated before answering… I didn’t get the job.

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ASolo
Oct 3, 2008 8:45 AM CST

I have worked at three Big Law firms and heard more sexist, racist comments and behavior than I care to ever remember.  The worst though came from a partner at Big Law in San Francisco.  This particular firm prided itself on being very progressive.  The partner, a woman, would never let a meeting go by without commenting on my sex life, love life, clothing or hair.  She consistently gave preference to junior male associates over female senior associates in doling out assignments.  Her most stunning comment though came during a meeting where an associate announced that he was going on safari to Africa.  We were very busy on the case at the time and in response she said “bring me back a slave.”  !!!  I left the firm shortly after that.  I reported her comment in an upwards review but she is still (unbelievably) there!

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dms
Oct 3, 2008 8:54 AM CST

While working as a paralegal/office manager for a sole (male) practitioner, we usually ate lunch together so we could continue our discussion of various office projects, cases, etc.  One day, he asked what I would like to do for lunch; I replied that I wasn’t certain.  He responded with “Well, I’m sure there’s a hotel nearby with decent room service.” 
I immediately called his wife and asked if she would like to join us for lunch at the local tex-mex eatery.

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zippy
Oct 3, 2008 9:18 AM CST

Some years ago, a newly-appointed executive in my government agency held “get to know you” meetings with her new subordinates.  She asked me a seemingly innocuous question about hobbies and volunteer work, and I mentioned that I was a volunteer leader in my son’s Boy Scout Troop.  Which caused her to immediately launch into a 20-minute tirade about “evil” Boy Scouts, and to directly assuse me of being a homophobe and bad parent for associating with such a politically incorrect organization.  I later learned my experience was far from unique; a co-worker who had volunteered for years with Catholic Charities literally left the boss’s office in tears.  Perhaps not coincidentally, this particular exec didn’t last very long before it was quietly suggested she submit her resignation to “pursue other interests.”

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RF
Oct 3, 2008 9:44 AM CST

This wasn’t in an interview or performance review, but I was once asked by some superior attorneys in the government office where I was working whether I could put together a short manual detailing how to “pick good black jurors.”  Because I did not routinely strike all black people from my juries and still obtained convictions, the up-highs in the office thought it would be great to teach the other prosecutors how to separate the “good” blacks from the “bad” ones.

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AroundtheBlock
Oct 3, 2008 10:02 AM CST

I’ve been working since the mid 70’s, so I thought I’d heard and seen just about everything.  What surprised me though, was the shock and surprise reported by the other responders – yes this really goes on – don’t be surprised, be prepared. 
After working in various industries, I settled into a law firm several years ago.  The biggest difference in law firms is that since lawyers know the law, they are used to making decisions based on acceptable risk.  I have seen far more illegal questions, remarks, and activities in law firms than I ever did in the “outside” world.

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mills
Oct 3, 2008 10:16 AM CST

In the mid-1980s, I was in an interview at a company with the General Counsel and CFO.  The CFO asked me if I had any serious illness such as cancer.  He went on to explain that they had hired someone who had cancer and that person’s medical bills caused their health insurance premiums to increase.  I could not believe that the General Counsel would let an officer of the company not only ask such a question, but to explain why the question was asked.

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Karen Lipney
Oct 3, 2008 10:29 AM CST

I was asked if I was married.

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Robbie
Oct 3, 2008 10:43 AM CST

8 years ago when I was just out of law school and searching for a job, i applied at a mid-size lawfirm in OKC.  Apparently there had been several other female attorneys who also had applied for the position.  The managing attorney (an older gentleman) and I talked back and forth for quite a while and I thought things were going great.  But then he started questioning me about my personal life, my husband and my children.  When he asked, “Does your husband usually take care of the children or do you?” -I stood up and said “I really don’t think my personal life has anything to do with my abilities to do this job!”  You know what he said??  He said “Right answer!!  I have been waiting for a woman to stand up to me all week!”  - I got the job.

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S.
Oct 3, 2008 11:32 AM CST

While in law school, I interviewed to be a law clerk at a large labor union.  During the interview I was asked by two well experienced counselors when I had graduated from high school.

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RWC
Oct 3, 2008 11:44 AM CST

My husband and I both have stories to tell.  When I was interviewing for my current job, the interviewer (only 4 years older than me) asked if I have kids, when he saw me looking at the photos on his desk.  I jokingly responded, “Isn’t that question illegal?” and then proceeded to tell him about my infant daughter.  We shared stories and to this day are friends.  Months after I started on the job, I ribbed him about his question, and he told me that after my interview he went to a colleague to ask if the question was illegal… he really had no idea! 

As for my husband, while still a law student and after accepting a job at his law firm, he attended a fall recruiting event.  It was the middle of September, and a senior associate commented how she’d met her billables for the year.  My husband must have looked like he was going to pass out from shock… until the associate explained that the firm’s billable year ended Sept 30th (the end of the fiscal year)!

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Maddie
Oct 3, 2008 12:13 PM CST

Not illegal, but nevertheless an amusing anecdote about stereotypes.

While in law school in Los Angeles, I was looking for firms in DC because my boyfriend is originally from that area.  The DC firms would always ask why I wanted to move to DC, and I told them about my boyfriend.  Invariably, men, women, old, young, they ALL asked, “Oh, is he in law school, too?”

Nope.  He never even attended college.  I always wondered if male applicants would be asked the same thing about their girlfriends.

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Dana
Oct 3, 2008 12:28 PM CST

While interviewing for my first job as an attorney, the associate interviewing me casually stated that she was taking a month off for maternity leave.  About 10 minutes into the interview she said something akin to because she would be gone for a month, the firm can’t hire an attorney that would also have to leave for a few days or weeks, within the next year.  Towards the end of the interview, I was asked, “I can’t really ask you this because it is illegal to do so, so you don’t have to answer, but are you planning on having a family soon?”  I was desperate for a job so I said, “No! Not for a few years at least.”  To which she remarked, good, because we can’t handle any more pregnancies around here…. I was shocked that this was coming from the only female associate in the firm that was pregnant!  If we are going to act as bad as our male counterparts, we’re doomed! 
Amazingly, during my next interview at another firm, I was told that the female partner never missed a day of work during her pregnancy.  In fact, she dictated a letter over the phone to her secretary a few seconds before she delivered her child.  Shockingly, she was in the office the next morning, on time. 
As you can expect, two interviews and two stories later, I was a little disgruntled about the career choice I had made in life!

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Withheld
Oct 3, 2008 12:36 PM CST

Are you LDS (Latter Day Saint aka Morman)?

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