What Gender Gap? Many Women Lawyers w/ Kids Do as Well as Men, Researcher Says

bg
May 13, 2009 12:34 AM CST

Did we really need a study to tell us this?  If I take a couple of years off to do anything - raise children, raise beets, travel, change professions, whatever - it is going to put me behind my classmates in terms of salary and partnership.  And it seems rather obvious that those who have taken time off and now work less in order to spend more time with their families are going to be happier - or simply less conflicted - than those who work more and thus can spend less time with their young children.  Sorry, but it doesn’t take a rocket scientist - or in this case a law professor - to figure that out.

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DR
May 13, 2009 1:32 PM CST

Here is my view on the subject:  if you view law as a “career” in which your successes are measured by a paycheck and partnership, then time off or part-time, no matter how minimal, will probably have a negative effect on reaching that goal.  It would be the same if you were working up the ladder to be a CEO in a company or otherwise.

If you view law as a profession, a serious pursuit by which your successes are measured by more than a paycheck or partnership, then scaling back hours to take care of family (whether children, elders, others) shouldn’t have a negative impact on your ability to be a good lawyer.  Even if you drop out of the law firm race, you can still hang a shingle and call yourself a lawyer. 

I find the whole “career” end of lawyering annoying and these studies always seem to be based on one model:  law firm partnership.  I don’t think you have to follow one model to be successful.

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Snowguy
May 14, 2009 8:31 AM CST

“At what point will our industry recognize that there is value to be assigned to having well rounded happy lawyers working for you? At what point will we realize that working “part time” as a lawyer doesn’t make you any less dedicated to your firm or your clients or less of a lawyer?

At what point will you get real about how law firms work?  Having kids reduces your available work hours.  Fewer work hours almost always means less in collected receipts.  Less collected receipts means less $ for firm.  Less money for firm means less value to firm.

But, hey, if you feel your “value” is not being recognized, the double glass door in the lobby is unlocked and wide open for your exit.  Surely someone else will give you a similar, or larger, salary for your value, right?

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bg
May 14, 2009 8:26 PM CST

If you take significant time away from work for any purpose, put in few hours, generate fewer billables than your peers within the firm, then yes, you will not be paid the same amount as your who graduated the same year as you nor will you make partner at the same time.  It is a no brainer.  The reason for the time away is irrelevant.  Should a person be given free credit or dollars simply because one reason is more admirable?  If I am run over by a drunk driver on my way to get lunch tomorrow and out of work because of my injuries for the next eight months, should I receive “lock step” pay increases as other attorneys in my firm that were in my class in law school?  NO!  “But it is not my fault that I was hit and out of work for so long, why should I be penalized?”  Because I am now 8 months behind my peers, that’s why!  It does not matter if the reason you are away is because you had a baby, were injured, took a round the world trip, or simply decided to sit on the couch and eat bonbons for eight months.  If you do not put in the same hours or time, you should not receive the same amount of pay or be credited with the same tenure level in the firm.  Pure and simple. 

But as DR said, success is measured by many things.  Quite frankly, money and partnership seem to be the biglaw measure of success.  Personally, I prefer to make a comfortable living, be proud of what I do with an ability to sleep at night, enjoy what I do, be challenged by what I do, and have enough time for family, friends, and whatever I want to do outside of work.  Unfortunately, this is not an objective measure, and makes for far less sexy headlines.

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NN
May 15, 2009 6:34 AM CST

I think something is missing here - this article differenciates between career opportunities for those taking time off to have children and for taking time off and working fewer hours for child care. I’m not sure I get that difference - how does one have children and not care for them? I guess with a highly paid nanny and no real parenting. I have never understood the law firm model of no life outside the firm - it is not human; it is not healthy; it does not create productive members of society; and it makes for a lot of bad (non-existant) parenting. I find it interesting that this biglaw model that lawyers continue to complain about continues to exist with little or no change. It is sad that we, as a profession, can’t be more creative than that!

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laura
May 15, 2009 7:23 AM CST

Would be more interesting if it even mildly took into account the fact that 1) society expects women to have children, 2) women’s bodies & brains expect them to have children, 3) women can’t do so without taking time off (unless you want ‘em to squat down in the middle of their office, tie the baby to their back, and get on with their work), 4) women are almost always expected to be the primary caregiver to their child and are often pressured, harrassed, or ridiculed if they allow their partner or other family member to do most of the heavy lifting, etc. 

We’re not idiots.  We know that if you take a year off, you’re going to be behind.  But to equate having a child with raising beets… when’s the last time you felt pressured from all sides to do something that is considered by many, if not most, to be the primary objective of your sex, and that activity was beet farming?  Come on.

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Rebecca
May 15, 2009 7:46 AM CST

What this study does not take into account is the fact that many women attorneys who are “part time” are really full-time attorneys who were forced to take go 80% just to be able to leave work in time to pick their children up from daycare.  By segregating out all “part timers,” this study fails to consider the staggering number of women who are capable and willing to practice full time, but are driven to accept less pay and the stigma of “part time” in order to be able to say “no” to overbearing partners and have the ability to say “I need to leave now” at the end of what any normal person would consider a long day of work.

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Snowguy
May 15, 2009 8:57 AM CST

“Sadly, the firms trick recruits into thinking they are getting a “desk job” instead of combat duty. “

I often joke that large law firms depend on recruiting indebted, clueless law grads who never worked in a law firm the way the Marines depend on recruiting hormone-addled teenagers who never felt a bullet enter their skin.  Of course, the Marines at least provide training and reality-based managers for the later hell their recruits experience…

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HVB
May 15, 2009 12:44 PM CST

Nancy, I don’t disagree with the distinction you draw between men and women.  Do you find it wrong, or just sad, that it is now illegal for you to make hring and staffing decisions on the basis of something you believe is true? And because your view is one of opinion and perception, would you accept a countervailing opinion about the genders, even one held by another female?

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Attorney Obvious
May 16, 2009 5:56 AM CST

After working at my first lawyer job for a year or two, and the associates were grumbling about low pay, no bonuses, no mentoring, etc., I had an epiphany.  Somehow, something I learned in law school actually squirmed its way from my cerebral trash bin into my inbox: “A partnership exists to make profits for the partners.” 

Once I accepted that fact, everything else that I have experienced in my career makes sense.  Partnerships do not exist to make employees happy, or to fairly reward people.  They exist solely to make money for the partners.  You can either accept that fact and deal with it, or you will spend the rest of your career complaining for no good reason, and to no effect.

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LanceSmith
May 25, 2009 2:28 PM CST

One more article - to add to the MOUNTAIN of evidence already available - that shows unequivocally that the pay gap (along with the concomitant glass ceiling) are due to nothing more or less then the choices women make. Perhaps soon the women-as-perpetual-victims crowd will wake up and shut up so we can all move on to more important things.

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