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Lawyer Pay

Some D.C. Associates to Reap Bonuses Above $100K

Posted Feb 4, 2008 11:41 AM CST
By Debra Cassens Weiss

Some associates at Washington, D.C., law firms are getting 2007 bonuses that are higher than $100,000, but the picture isn’t as rosy for 2008.

John Childers, a legal consultant at Hildebrandt International, told Legal Times he expects bonuses to be “fairly healthy” for 2007, but that may not be the case when 2008 bonuses are handed out. "We are hearing from our clients that this year isn't going to be as good as the last six years," he said.

Legal Times tallied the bonuses at several D.C. law firms. It reports bonuses as high as $115,000 at Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom; $100,000-plus at Arent Fox; and $95,000 at Hogan & Hartson. The bonuses are partly performance-based.

Comments

1.

Alvin D. Chimpunkski
Feb 8, 2008 7:14 AM CST

How do these associates make bonuses bigger than my salary.  I’ve been working for 8 years and don’t make this money.  My goal is to make what a first year associate makes before I retire.  With all the disparity going on, will Obama save us?  Can we rely on a Harvard Law School graduate to make it right when he’s president of the US of A?  Let’s hope someone can do something.  The president makes $400K per year.  That’s out of my league,

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2.

BIGLAW 1ST YEAR
Feb 8, 2008 7:37 AM CST

What are you talking about Chipmunk?  Obama may be a socialist but even I don’t believe he is that much of a socialist.

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3.

ALEXCARP
Feb 8, 2008 8:29 AM CST

If people stopped paying these big-time law firms that still screw-up from time to time, the bonuses and salaries would at least be a little more reasonable.  But let’s face it, they work twice the hours of us “normal” people.  I think.

Still, I hope no first year associate is getting a 100K bonus - no first year assoc. is worth that.

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4.

Mark Pitchford
Feb 8, 2008 8:49 AM CST

Thanks for another article damaging our profession.

Why can the Journal never report averages?  I suppose that would take too much work, and an average bonus of $2 just isn’t that sexy.

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5.

anon
Feb 8, 2008 8:53 AM CST

Chipmunk - I think Cuba and China are still communist. Maybe you should practice law there. Clients pay what the market demands. If they could get the same service for less money they would.  I don’t think we should penalize people for working hard to get into a good law school, even harder to graduate at the top of their class, and then willing to work hard at a top firm.  If everyone paid the same I may be happy with a 9-5 government job.  With all your experience in 8 years, maybe you should apply to a big firm.

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6.

Rick
Feb 8, 2008 9:21 AM CST

Mark - agreed.  A miniscule fraction of lawyers get a big bonus…. what worthless information.  Someone won the lottery too but it has no bearing on the rank and file (who also pay the lion’s share of dues to the ABA).  Give us useful information.

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7.

Hadley V. Baxendale
Feb 8, 2008 10:40 AM CST

Rick and Mark—every week I say the same thing as you did, and every week a third of the stories are about the Biglaw aberration.  Good analogy on the lottery.  Clearly the ABA Pub Board either doesn’t read these comments or doesn’t care about accurate reporting.  Let’s each send a direct letter to the real editor about this.

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8.

Clay
Feb 8, 2008 11:26 AM CST

Rick, Mark, and Hadley: These “top stories” that are sent out by e-mail every week are apparently selected because they are the most read.  So, I don’t think the editors are choosing which articles to include on the list.  Rather, they’re sending us what most of us (apparently) want to read.

So, you could help select which articles go out by finding the one called “Lawyer saves cat stuck in tree,” and clicking on it a few hundred thousand times. . .

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9.

BIGLAW 1ST YEAR
Feb 8, 2008 11:55 AM CST

Getting a good job is not anything like the lottery (unless you were lucky enough to be born a minority or into a family with connections), anyone who says it is must be a sore loser in the rat race that is life.

How many people do you know that won the lottery compared to those that work at a big firm?  I, for one, know thousands of the latter and none of the former.

Moreover, the lottery is based on luck and it is usually an uneducated idiot who wins (what rational person would buy a ticket in the first place?).  Big firm jobs, on the other hand, go to the smatest individuals with the highest educational attainment.

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10.

Adam
Feb 8, 2008 12:03 PM CST

“lucky enough to be born a minority”  Are you serious?

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11.

Will
Feb 8, 2008 12:16 PM CST

BIGLAW 1ST Year- What in the world do you mean “lucky enough to be born a minority”. That is the stupid mentality that we are trying to get rid of. For the record being born a minority is not the best thing in the world. You are scrutinized before you even speak and work twice as hard just to be noticed. So think before you type next time.

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12.

Tim
Feb 8, 2008 12:17 PM CST

I agree with Adam.  Is BIGLAW’s comment serious?  As for “winning the lottery” as a minority:

In two recent studies, Princeton University sociologist Devah Pager showed that young black men who have played by the rules and have no criminal record are much less likely to be offered a job than similar white men. In fact, white men with criminal records had an equal or better chance of being hired than did young black men with no record.

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13.

James
Feb 8, 2008 12:20 PM CST

“Big firm jobs . . . go to the smatest [sic] individuals with the highest educational attainment.”  I’ll give you highest educational attainment (based on “rankings”)...but smartest?  not always, my friend.  But, then again, people have different ideas about what makes a “good job.”  I am a 4th year at a medium firm in a medium city, make probably half of what “BIGLAW FIRST YEAR” makes and am supremely happy with the quality of work I get at my well-respected boutique firm, the smart, fun, and balanced people I work with (including partners that are known in their field throughout the nation and the world), and, of course, getting off work while it’s still light outside and taking lots of weekend trips on my own time.

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14.

relocated from DC
Feb 8, 2008 12:27 PM CST

James:
Remember, this is DC we’re talking about.  If you leave the office while it is still light, you will suffer through hours of traffic. But to each his own, I’ve worked at BIGLAW and now at a smaller law firm and I must say the money is not worth it for me.  And its not the work that I don’t miss, it’s the biglaw egos.

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15.

interested
Feb 8, 2008 12:39 PM CST

As far as people getting into top ranked law schools, you have to have excellent undergrad grades (that means work hard), and have an excellent LSAT score (which is the closest proxy for showing intelligence in the law school setting that they can come up with). So dumb people aren’t going to big name law schools. Then, you have to have a little luck and some hard work to end up in the top of your class to get the Big Law job. Bottom line, really smart people who work hard are the majority of those in Big Law. Whether they get paid what they are worth is a different story.

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16.

James
Feb 8, 2008 12:49 PM CST

Those in Biglaw are smart.  They are some of the smartest, but other smart people (such as “relocated”  and others of my acquaintance) have made other decisions with their life for different reasons.  And it’s easy to forget that smart doesn’t always equal capable (although it usually does, for sure).  That’s a great thing about our profession—there’s generally a place for everyone who can do the work, depending on what each individual values.

Relocated:  I forgot what big city traffic can be like since my relocation as well!  Getting off work early wouldn’t be such a treat in DC!

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17.

Carrie
Feb 8, 2008 1:46 PM CST

It’s ironic that so many are criticizing BigLaw’s lucky comment when your remarks are just as bad.  Don’t feel sorry for me because I am a minority.  Hiding your prejudice by lashing out at others for not being politically correct is worse.

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18.

M Law
Feb 8, 2008 1:56 PM CST

Comments like “lucky enough to be born a minority” indicate ignorance and a deep misunderstanding of what it means to succeed and be a minority in this country.  Minorities in the US still struggle tremendously to get to levels of main stream society that white America take for granted.  And to think that minorities have a hand up in the race for success in professional world comes from a point of view that is definitely not in touch with reality and probably comes from someone who may be both incapable and spoiled.

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19.

Rick
Feb 8, 2008 2:50 PM CST

“Big firm jobs, on the other hand, go to the smatest individuals with the highest educational attainment.” -BIGLAW 1ST YEAR. 

We all see that you’re “smat” and have high educational attainment.  Now, how about addressing the point that the ABA directs their articles to a very small minority and doesn’t address the experience of the majority of lawyers?

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20.

Will
Feb 8, 2008 3:28 PM CST

Carrie- No one is lashing out at BIGLAW. Every comment directed toward him is to educate him on a fact that he clearly knows nothing about.  Even if I was not a minority, I would feel weird reading his comment. His comment also shows that he thinks by seeing a minority in an office means they got the job because they were a minority and not because they are capable of doing the job they were hired to do. I don’t think anyone is hiding prejudice here, it was just a stupid comment he made and it’s offensive.

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21.

Confused Associate
Feb 8, 2008 3:44 PM CST

Will, please explain why when I see a minority I shouldn’t think they got the job due to affirmative action.  That is what affirmative action does, it gives the job to minorities who otherwise wouldn’t get it on the merits.  Of course, some minorities will get jobs they are qualified for, but statistics show that most of them get in through affirmative action in the legal world.  I don’t see what is offensive about inferring a widely known FACT.  If affirmative action didn’t exist, however, and somebody thought that about a minority, that of course would be racist because it is baseless.

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22.

David
Feb 8, 2008 4:19 PM CST

This is not only pertains to a very small percentage of firms/associates, but they soon leave the firm/area/profession.  Their schedules and cost of living cannot be sustained for more than a couple of years, at most.  If you happen to have a family also, it is to your extreme detriment if you stay on. 
Simply said, there is a balance to pretty much everything.

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23.

anon
Feb 8, 2008 4:41 PM CST

I think some of the comments from biglaw types were sparked by the first comment in the post.  It seemed to suggest that biglaw attorneys made too much and Obama should create some sort of socialist program to make the comparison less stark.  If someone chooses to work at a mid-size firm and make less money that is great.  If someone chooses and is able to work at biglaw and make more money then that is great.  Capitalism is great.  The problem is that some people are working at smaller firms or making less money and are bitter and upset that biglaw makes so much (e.g. Chipmunkski).  Also, some biglaw folks may think that they are better than everyone else.

And for another comment ... DC is great. I have a 25 min door-to-door commute, make enough money, and don’t work too hard (maybe harder than someone at a mid-size firm in a mid-size city but I’m still happy)

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24.

Anonymous Lawyer
Feb 9, 2008 12:52 AM CST

I think I speak for/echo most of the people who still bother to read this drivel when I say, g*ddamn, I’m tired of reading about how much biglaw associates make!

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25.

Former BigLaw
Feb 11, 2008 9:33 AM CST

This article, among so many others, is why non-equity (junior) partners are leaving BigLaw in droves.  I spent 10 years in a Chicago BigLaw firm, made partner early in my career, then watched associates salaries rise at an astounding pace.  In the four years I worked as a partner, I made less money than all but the most junior associates and I worked significantly harder.  I thought I was stuck, until I found out that smaller, boutique law firms are eager to pay hardworking junior partners as much, if not more, than BigLaw…and the hours are far better.  So, BigLaw associates, enjoy the bounty now and squirrel away your $100K bonuses….because only the cream of the crop will be rewarded a partnership and they will find the “reward” is anything but.

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26.

E.
Feb 13, 2008 12:35 AM CST

Wow, all these comments are truly amazing. Put down your pencils, Rick, Mark, and Hadley, may be this clarification of what 25 said will help: the story forgot to mention that these bonuses go to a random few 8th or 9th year + associates who got passed over for partner, but want to be kept around by the firm for one reason or another.  Incidentally, this also allows the firm to quote a fancy statistic about itself to help market its image. So no, this is no lottery ticket.  Also, this isn’t news at all - these kinds of bonuses have been around for quite a while at many firms. Btw, Mark, an accurate quantitative analysis of average associate bonuses is impossible, and if you had a job anywhere near Biglaw, you would understand why.

To the delusional BIGLAW 1ST YEAR: I am truly astounded by your original, critical thinking here, and I have no doubt you will go far in life. And by that I mean in two years you will blow a fuse realizing just how irrational people all around you - colleagues, judges, and clients - can be.  I hope you had spent some time developing a back-up plan for life while talking short breaks from listening to what you thought was gospel espoused by your economics and philosophy professors.

To those who claim superiority over biglaw associates because they get out of work while it’s still light out, I have great news for you! You will have great work-life balance. Do enjoy American Idol, America’s Next Top Model, Top Chef, Food Network Star, etc – it’s as close to being at the top of any professional field as you will ever get. You see, in the legal profession, no matter where you work (biglaw, smalllaw, d.a.’s office), unless you put in the time, your career is going nowhere, leaving you with plenty of time to nourish your ever-so-exhilarating life.

And to everyone else: if you can just figure out a way to direct all that passion, frustration, and energy into your work and work-product, you may just find yourself a successful, upwardly moving, and happy, well-compensated lawyer, with a decent family life, but likely not very much tv-time, and definitely NO time to complain about other people’s money.

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