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1. Posted by Betty Slinter - 4 months, 3 days, 4 hours, 28 minutes ago

   What a surprise. Women who can’t handle when other people aren’t nice to them, or who don’t create a “safe”“environment” where they can “feel safe” and discuss “women’s issues.“ And this is supposed the show they can be treated as equals, how exactly?

2. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 3 days, 4 hours, 23 minutes ago

   Sometimes women are their own worst enemy when it comes to being treated equally among men. Men brush this stuff off, women get “so stressed by Internet attack[s] that [they] take a leave of absence from law school.“ Impressive there, ladies.

3. Posted by Ellen Barshevsky - 4 months, 3 days, 3 hours, 58 minutes ago

   You two are being UNFAIR to women.  We deserve to be treateed with RESPECT.  If men are unable to respect us, then they are not men, but BOYS, and boys who deserved to be punished.  I think its high time that these BOYS learn to go back into their sandbox and play with their own toys, because no self - respecting women will want ANYTHING to do with them.  If you nip the problem in the bud, these BOYS won’t grow up to be lawyers where they will do the SAME thing to us females while employed under their control.  I say KUDOs to the law school for this!

4. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 3 days, 3 hours, 36 minutes ago

   No, I wasn’t being unfair. I was making a comment about how women want to be treated “equally” but can’t understand that “equally” also sometimes means “as bad as other men are treated.“ Or it means “billing 2200 hours EVEN WHEN your kid is sick,“ et cetera. Being treated equally doesn’t mean being treated well, or as fragile dainties, or even nicely. It means being treated the same—and sometimes that sucks. So the point remains: men brush this stuff off. Women whine and cry to the high heaven because they can’t handle it.

5. Posted by Kay Bee - 4 months, 3 days, 3 hours, 34 minutes ago

   Honestly, despite portrayals in the media to the contrary, I don’t think it’s a woman’s rights issue, it’s a harassment issue. Like a bathroom wall or a desk, just because the Internet is there does not mean it’s an appropriate forum for discussing the desire that criminal acts be carried out against anyone. Further, the fact that it was on the web rather than on a bathroom wall means that Googling the name of the women by a potential employer could have brought the posts to the employer’s attention, and many wouldn’t want to attract that kind of drama. Despite the sympathy-seeking language of females having a “safe” environment, it really is about anyone having a safe environment—would a guy still feel comfortable in his life if death threats (or even rape threats) were being posted about him online and he didn’t know where they were coming from? Perhaps some could brush it off, but for those who couldn’t, I don’t know that we’d be seeing this level of vitriol.

6. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 3 days, 3 hours, 33 minutes ago

   I should clarify that last comment. “SOME” women cry and whine to the high heaven because they can’t handle it. And that leads me back to the original point—that sometimes women are their own worst enemy in demanding “equality.“

7. Posted by Ellen Barshevsky - 4 months, 3 days, 3 hours, 29 minutes ago

   Well you don’t know what it is like to be sexually objectivized.  This web site advocated sexually assaulting certain women law students.  That is JUVENILE and punishable.  If you ever had to walk a mile in my shoes, as a female in a male dominated society, where men look at me and I can only dream of what they are thinking when they give me the eye—then you would better understand where WE women are coming from when we get upset when men POO-POO our concerns.  I had a male friend in law school who told me what a lot of otherwise friendly men REALLY thought of me when they confided in my friend—they focused not on my brains, but on my looks.  To me they would discuss the cases, but really were interested in sexually persuing me.  You should just think about it, before condemming women who have responsibilities as WOMEN.  We are not fragile dainties, we are WOMEN who should not be prejudiced against because we need to take care of women things.

8. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 3 days, 3 hours, 28 minutes ago

   @ Kay Bee. It is a “harassment” issue, of course. Men just deal with it, dish it back out, brush it off, whatever. Most of them give it no thought whatsoever, and they certainly don’t get ka-wrazy!! about anonymous comments on the internet. Generally men don’t expect a “safe” environment because there’s no such thing. The world isn’t the Oprah show and being treated equally doesn’t mean being treated nicely, fairly, or anything else.

9. Posted by Betty Slinter - 4 months, 3 days, 3 hours, 21 minutes ago

   I know what it is like to be “sexually objectivized,“ and I’ve walked my whole life in your shoes. I know what men are thinking, and trust me, I get the eye CONSTANTLY. But get this: I STILL “poo-poo” most women and their “issues,“ and their “concerns,“ and that they need to feel “safe” at Women’s Workout World. Why? Because not everyone on earth agrees with your “concerns” or your “issues,“ or cares what is inside the heads of other people that they cannot, and will never ever be able to, control. I mean, listen to you: “You should just think about it, before condemming women who have responsibilities as WOMEN.  We are not fragile dainties, we are WOMEN who should not be prejudiced against because we need to take care of women things.“ If you need to do all that, do it, go nuts. But don’t think that a) all women agree with your victim mentality, b) that all women cry themselves to sleep because they just cain’t handul what some other guy *may* have in his mind, and c) that men, in generally, could really care less what you as a woman (or women) think. You don’t seem to care what they think (or you care too much), why should they care what you think?

10. Posted by Ellen Barshevsky - 4 months, 3 days, 3 hours, 16 minutes ago

    FOOEY ON THIS!  This is so typical male.  Not recognizing that women are not 100% interchangeable with men and men and not interchangeable with women.  MEN must learn to respect differences, as we women have learned to do with men.  We know that certain things we could not care less about men care about so we accommodate them.  MEN must learn to do the same.  Women are often said to be the weaker sex.  In reality, we must be stronger to deal with all of this.  We are also the SMARTER sex, in the long run, because it’s survival of the fittest.  If we cowered every time some man roared, where would we be?  Getting dragged around into a cave by a man.  That is 10,000 years ago, fellas, and we’re not living in a cave any more.  I say respect differences, and treat us fairly and we will do the same.  We put up with a lot of stuff, and you shouldn’t be so high and mighty defending ruffians that want to defile us.

11. Posted by NJHandyGirl - 4 months, 3 days, 3 hours, 13 minutes ago

    I find it interesting that Mr. Eddington would say “Men just deal with it…“ I don’t know many men who would just brush off rape threats or death threats. Regardless of the target of this behavior, it is troubling and disturbing. The public has negative views about lawyers as is, we don’t need perverts to add to those ideas. This juvenile behavior should not be tolerated regardless of the gender of the target.

    Further, the fact that you liken the reaction to this behavior in the same grain as “billing 2200 hours even when your kid is sick” just shows that you don’t get what the complaint is about. One has nothing to do with the other. I know the world is not safe, most of us women do. But, that does not mean I have to tolerate those who make it less safe. That’s what prosecution is for.

    It is bad enough I can’t jog alone in my park at night without fear of sexual assault…I shouldn’t have to come to the office and deal with it.

12. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 3 days, 3 hours, 5 minutes ago

    Men know women are not 100% interchangeable as men. Duh. In fact, that’s WHY they are often treated differently. Take away treating them differently, say for example in the military, sports, and yes, even law school admissions, and they will fall back, significantly. But men must learn to respect differences? Why, because you sez so? News flash: Men are individuals (just as women are), so there will ALWAYS be the behavior that you so decry—get used to it. Women are the smarter sex? Well, good luck with that one—you had better pray to Jeebus that more of them start with the Carly Fiorina or Indra Nooyi routine instead of the “whine to Oprah because they don’t feel safe routine.“ To be clear, I didn’t defend anyone who defiled anyone else—I made the point that filing suit because some eeeevil person made some eeeevil comments on the interweb dealio does not lend credence to the idea that women can handle being treated equally.

13. Posted by Ellen Barshevsky - 4 months, 3 days, 3 hours, 2 minutes ago

    Thank you!!! Women of accomplishment, like us, worked hard.  We studied, graduated law school, passed the bar and deserve to be treated as PROFESSIONALS, not as meat on the rack.  I refused to be objectivized by some snivveling weasel who barely got through law school just because his uncle is a partner at the law firm I summered at between my junior and senior year.  And if I REFUSED then, then certainly now, when I have my full credential as a lawyer, refuse to cow-tow to these same men, who for some unknown reason think they are God’s gift to us—believe me, these guys turn me off! 

    If you men feel like you’ve been neutered sometimes, just go back and think how you could have been more accommodating.  If you think and act right, you will be better off and women will treat you right.  Otherwise, you will continue to sulk at the bars watching the professionals play ball on TV while you only dream of getting the attention they do.

14. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 3 days, 2 hours, 58 minutes ago

    @NJHandyGirl: And how many men do you know that would come running to you to tell you how they don’t feel safe, or that they feel violated by internet postings? I never made the case that idiots on the internet aren’t idiots, I said that running to Oprah does not help the idea that women can handle equality. While it is “bad enough I can’t jog alone in my park at night without fear of sexual assault…“ men would have to deal with being physically assaulted. But we aren’t taking about these fragiles were being treated at the office, we were discussing how they were treated online, in a forum where they couldn’t really realistically have an expectation of it being nestled between the arms of Oprah.

15. Posted by Ellen Barshevsky - 4 months, 3 days, 2 hours, 51 minutes ago

    I dont even watch Oprah Winfree, so there, Mr Smarty-Pants.  You just don’t get it, and I can’t explain it any more for you.  I suggest you call a trusted female friend (if you have one), show her these BLAWG posts, and ask her for her opinion.  If she’s not a cave-woman, she should be able to explain it to you.  Good luck—this is a very important lesson for you.

16. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 3 days, 2 hours, 50 minutes ago

    This is funny: “Thank you!!! Women of accomplishment, like us, worked hard.  We studied, graduated law school, passed the bar and deserve to be treated as PROFESSIONALS, not as meat on the rack.“ Ah, yes you’re so adequate that you must proclaim from the highest mountaintops how adequate you are. Never realizing that having to do so is probably evidence that you are not.  “I refused to be objectivized by some snivveling weasel who barely got through law school just because his uncle is a partner at the law firm I summered at between my junior and senior year.  And if I REFUSED then, then certainly now, when I have my full credential as a lawyer, refuse to cow-tow to these same men, who for some unknown reason think they are God’s gift to us—believe me, these guys turn me off!“ Oh dear jeebus. Testify, sistah! >arms waving in the air< Yew go, gurl! This stuff really demonstrates how strong you are. Really. Seriously. And it helps women’s issues too. For the rest of it? Ummmm, men don’t feel neutered, and most of us treat women (and men) the way we want to be treated. Just like most women do. Beyond that? Sometimes people treat other people in ways that they do not like. Welcome to reality. Make it gender issue all you wish, file suit, join Women’s Workout World, whatever you want—but don’t labor under the impression that that stuff helps convince others of anything other than weakness.

17. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 3 days, 2 hours, 45 minutes ago

    Hey look, I can make unfounded statements too: “YOU just don’t get it, and I can’t explain it any more for YOU. I suggest you call a trusted male friend (if you have one), show him these BLAWG posts, and ask him for his opinion.  If he’s not a cave-man, he should be able to explain it to you.  Good luck—this is a very important lesson for you.“ Wow. That’s really easy! Get this one, even easier: “Ms. Barshevsky: How do you write women so well? Mr. Eddington: I think of a man, and I take away reason and accountability.“ With apologies to the writers of “As Good As It Gets.“

18. Posted by NJHandyGirl - 4 months, 3 days, 2 hours, 1 minute ago

    All I can say is that I am very pleased that after “anonymously” posting these women’s names online, these guys get their names posted publicly in court papers. Kudos to the women for being smart enough to track them down and brave enough make them suffer the same humiliation.

    People (regardless of their gender) who think anyone (regardless of their gender) “should be raped” surely have no place next to me in a courtroom or boardroom for that matter.

19. Posted by Midwest - 4 months, 3 days, 1 hour, 24 minutes ago

    Wow!  I think some of you shouldstop posting - you are not coming across is a very good light.  This argument is a little embarassing to read.

20. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 3 days, 1 hour, 20 minutes ago

    Rest assured, they are there, right next to you. Just like the racists, homophobes, misogynists, rapists, molesters, et cetera. Most of them are just smart enough to keep their mouth shut about it.

21. Posted by J - 4 months, 3 days, 1 hour, 3 minutes ago

    I am very conflicted on this issue.

    First of all, I agree with the idea that WE, as women are often our own worst enemy. Possibly it’s just our physiology or whatever, but we are much more emotional and seem to stress needlessly. Often it just builds resentment and contributes to problems of inequality.

    That being said, I feel like I am one of those women that let’s things go so as not to rattle the cage. However, I have learned that when you don’t nip something in the bud it DOES get carried away because men always want to test how far they can go. I have had to deal with men yelling the “Hey baby” or “Damn your ass is sexy” or whatever, and let me tell you it’s not flattering when you’re walking with other male attorneys or judges. It’s mortifying. Especially when you are young trying to make an impression. You let those things go. But I have also had to deal with the people who make comments at work, older male attorneys who may not be my direct superiors but who are above me, and that is more than just uncomfortable. It starts out with the comments, but they escalate. Goes from “you look nice” to “you look hot” to “nice ass” to “I’d like to do some things to you” and so on and there have been people who have even tried to get physical. So while men are telling us to “get over it” you need to look at yourselves in the mirror and see how YOU have contributed to the problem and what you need to do to keep us from having something to get over.

22. Posted by NYC - 4 months, 3 days, 58 minutes ago

    Reading through the comments…I’m embarrassed of my profession.  Fortunately I’ve been mentored by and work with attorneys who know the meaning of respect and professionalism.  If the practice of law means taking it on the chin and sucking up to disrespectful a-holes…particularly one’s own peers…then you can have it!  It is not why I went into law and it is not why I buy the theory that in order to be equal one must willing to be treated badly.  What a moronic comment.  There are many, many attorneys out here who have built successful practices by being…should I say it….PROFESSIONAL.

23. Posted by Jen DC - 4 months, 3 days, 56 minutes ago

    I think the whole episode is simply another indicator that people should be forced to take a few years off between college and law school. It would decrease the number of these incidents cropping up and hopefully increase the general maturity of the students. 22 year olds simply aren’t prepared for the professional responsibility of entering a legal career at that age.

    As far as this ridiculous “men v. women” debate that seems to be happening here, the real issue, as stated by Kay Bee is one of harassment. The problem is when your detractors are anonymous and hiding behind two equally irresponsible enablers and only your name - the name of the victim of the unfounded (or even possibly even “founded”) attacks against which you cannot defend. You’re sacrificing the rights of one party (the victim) for the rights of the other party (the poster). As the victim, you never get to explain to an employer that you didn’t do anything to deserve the vicious labeling that’s going on out there.

24. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 2 days, 23 hours, 25 minutes ago

    @J:I agree with most of your comments, but you still do what Ms. Uberadequate Barshevsky does, and what a lot of people do: extrapolate from the bad behaviors of some individuals in order to impugn an entire gender and therefore maintain your pretty world view. I don’t EVER have to look in the mirror to see how I have contributed to the problem because I haven’t. I don’t make comments advocating the initiation of force against others. I don’t sneer or leer at women. Conversely, I don’t let any associate off the hook when their billable hours are sorely lacking, and I don’t care what gender they are. That’s called treating people equally—and it STILL raises the hackles of some people.

25. Posted by shawty - 4 months, 2 days, 23 hours, 21 minutes ago

    HAHAHA. Some of the Ladies on this board will be begging for the time they were “objectivized” by some “snivveling weasels” and treated as “meat on the bone”. Just wait till your pieces start falling apart. You will eat your words, believe me.

26. Posted by Palsgraff - 4 months, 2 days, 22 hours, 41 minutes ago

    This is hilarious.  I think the ultra-femenists on this blog just set thier movement back about 100 years.  Moreover, attractive people (male or female) tend to be more successfull financially in any business.  The “objectivized” women in the electronic and print media make more money in 1 year than any of us combined.  They don’t really feel victimized on a yacht in the Bahamas when you are grinding out your 2200 hours.

27. Posted by J - 4 months, 2 days, 22 hours, 38 minutes ago

    JimEddington, I don’t “impugn an entire gender”. The point I was making was, essentially, you’re damned if you do and damned if you don’t. If you complain about behaviors then you’re whining. If you don’t complain, then men will think they can take whatever liberties they want. And when I say “men”, I don’t mean ALL men. I am referring to the ones who engage in the type of behavior that you claim not to. It only escalates and I don’t see you proposing a solution to any of the concerns that have been proposed here.

    And I will tell you, as a 20-something fairly new female attorney, I personally put up with a lot of male garbage, while still billing my share of hours - I work long hours, go to the social events, and come back to the office to bill more hours. So your point seems somewhat unrelated to the topic at hand in that respect.

28. Posted by CM - 4 months, 2 days, 22 hours, 33 minutes ago

    Since this is a law blog, it makes sense to (a) read the complaint and (b) think about its allegations in terms of ordinary tort concepts like intentional infliction of emotional distress.  To judge by the allegations of the complaint, and by that I mean only the language that purports to be direct quotations, the posts at issue are shocking and disturbing to a degree that clears the tort threshold.  We’re not talking about the rough and tumble of real life.  These “commenters” appear to have arrogated to themselves the right to say deeply offensive things and to redouble their attacks when subjects have the temerity to protest.  To do such things anonymously is the mark of cowardice as well.  To the extent these actions cause emotional or economic harm, it is not hard to conclude that they cross lines defined by well-settled liability doctrine.  This is not a male/female issue, except in the sociological sense that one might wonder why men say these kinds of things about women but not vice versa.  It’s tortious, period.

29. Posted by Da Judge - 4 months, 2 days, 22 hours, 29 minutes ago

    CM—Cowards need a “safe zone” too. Hence, youre wrong.

30. Posted by J - 4 months, 2 days, 22 hours, 9 minutes ago

    CM,
    Nothing personal, because I have been known to do it as well, but what is it about saying “Period” at the end of a statement that makes people think they’ve accomplished something major in the argument? lol.

31. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 2 days, 22 hours, 1 minute ago

    @J: If you’re “damned if you do, and damned if you don’t” well, welcome to reality. I’m not proposing “a solution” because I don’t think there is one. Some people will ALWAYS treat other people poorly—no matter what you think about it, no matter how you wish it were otherwise, no matter how often some women find a “safe environment” where they can “discuss women’s issues,“ and no matter how often some of them proclaim their adequacy while demonstrating their inadequacy. That isn’t to say some men don’t do that either, of course. As far as what you’ve put up with from males, I’ve put up with a lot of female garbage as well, while still billing my share of hours. That’s called life.

32. Posted by Daniel Reitman - 4 months, 2 days, 21 hours, 9 minutes ago

    The reports of the messages in question, in my opinion, exceed banter and go to the level of harassment and several intentional torts.

33. Posted by Neil - 4 months, 2 days, 20 hours, 38 minutes ago

    he said - she said.  As an outsider looking at this profession, you all look like petty, narcissistic children.  Guess that’s why most of you grow up to be a-hole, douche bag lawyers, worrying about little more than how to bill more hours for your so-called work.  Face it, your “profession” is nasty, overpaid, and often detrimental to society.  Most of you have no conscience when it comes to putting ordinary people through the meat grinder; how does it feel when you eat your own?  Here’s a suggestion: Why not sue each other into obviation?  Here are some of my fav comments:

    Betty Slinter: I know what men are thinking, and trust me, I get the eye CONSTANTLY.
    Ellen Barshevsky: We are also the SMARTER sex, in the long run, because it’s survival of the fittest. If we cowered every time some man roared, where would we be? Getting dragged around into a cave by a man.
    Ellen Barshevsky: I dont even watch Oprah Winfree, so there, Mr Smarty-Pants.
    shawty: HAHAHA. Some of the Ladies on this board will be begging for the time they were “objectivized” by some “snivveling weasels” and treated as “meat on the bone”. Just wait till your pieces start falling apart. You will eat your words, believe me.

34. Posted by R - 4 months, 2 days, 19 hours, 50 minutes ago

    Excuse me, I thought this was the ABA Journal. But judging from the comments on both sides of this issue, I’ve obviously wandered into TMZ.com by mistake.

    Puerile slop.

    Posting people’s photos anonymously, and making anonymous online threats of harm, are actionable torts. Regardless of gender. End of story..

35. Posted by LA - 4 months, 2 days, 19 hours, 7 minutes ago

    This issue has nothing to do with claims of manufactured polarity between men and women; it has to do with accountability. A fresh take:
    http://www.bitterlawyer.com/index.php/site/columns_detail_comment/play_to_win/?cat_id=6

36. Posted by khazeh - 4 months, 2 days, 17 hours, 58 minutes ago

    Mr. Eddington apparently doesn’t realize that making threats of great bodily harm, or death threats, might lead to civil (if not criminal) liability, and that “but it was on an Internet board!“ is not a magic get-out-of-consequences free card. In the grown-up world, actions have consequences. That’s life. Bitter complains about how many hours women bill won’t change that.

37. Posted by Anon - 4 months, 2 days, 17 hours, 52 minutes ago

    I’m male, married,mid-40’s.  .  If the allegations are true, the postings appear actionable to me.  I’d certainly want to know about them before I interviewed any of the young law students who were posting the comments.  They’ll never be hired by my firm. 

    Having said that, many of the females on this thread have asserted that men don’t understand what they have to go through when they’re objectified, harassed, etc. 
    How can you possibly say that with a straight face?  Do you think that there aren’t homosexual harassers?  Does being a homosexual automatically change a man from a presumed sexual harasser into some sort of angelic being that would never, ever do the same sorts of things that nasty heterosexual men do?  The truth of the matter is that men are harassed too, they just rarely go public about it.  Many men have had unwelcome sexual advances, comments, touching, etc. from homosexual men and heterosexual women.  It happens.  Quit pretending that “it’s a woman thing, you wouldn’t understand.“  We get it.  We just deal with it differently.  We’re much more likely to beat the crap out of a homosexual harasser and to ignore a female harasser than we are to go public about either.

38. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 2 days, 17 hours, 25 minutes ago

    @Khazeh: I realize exactly what it is: mindless and empty threats and stupidity on an internet bulletin board. That it happens to be a bit more over the top than most people prefer—c’est la vie. I didn’t make any complaints about the billable hours of women. There’s nothing to complain about—they, just like everyone else, either make their numbers or they do not.

39. Posted by Al Tidom - 4 months, 2 days, 17 hours, 5 minutes ago

    I’ve read all the posts, and conclude that the women may be sensitive, but Mr. Eddington (if that’s his real name) is living in a dream world.

40. Posted by Stephanie - 4 months, 2 days, 17 hours, 3 minutes ago

    I agree that several of these comments are embarrasing to the profession and I haven’t even graduated law school yet.  “Take away treating them differently, say for example in the military, sports, and yes, even law school admissions, and they will fall back, significantly.“  Jim Eddington, get a clue.  I hope that you and the other people who are speaking of the female law students in question have at least read up on the issue to see for yourselves the extent of this “hate blogging.“

41. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 2 days, 17 hours, 2 minutes ago

    I’ve read all the posts, and conclude that the women may be sensitive, but Mr. Al Tidom (if that’s his real name) is living in a dream world. Geez is that easy. No thought, no effort, nothing whatsoever but empty rhetoric.

42. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 2 days, 16 hours, 59 minutes ago

    Stephanie, get a clue.  I hope that you and the other people who are speaking of the female law students in question have at least read up on the internet to see how this stuff happens hundreds of thousands of times on thousands of sites, all over the world. You can’t stop it, you can’t prevent it, and you’ll never stop people from being crappy to each other. Talk about needing a clue.

43. Posted by Stephanie - 4 months, 2 days, 16 hours, 57 minutes ago

    @ Jim Eddington:“...mindless and empty threats and stupidity on an internet bulletin board.“  Who are you to determine that these threats were not likely to be carried out?  Do you realize that some of the bloggers were classmates at her school, whose identity she did not know.  Further, there were blogs from guys who recognized her at the gym; these same people were encouraged to take pictures of her and post them as well.  This young woman was basically attacked, defamed, and harrassed simply for requesting to have her pictures removed from a website.

44. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 2 days, 16 hours, 43 minutes ago

    @Stephanie: Who are you to determine that these threats were likely to be carried out? Of course she didn’t know who they were—duh. None of that has any bearing on the fact that this stuff happens hundreds of thousands of times on thousands of sites, all over the world. You can’t stop it, you can’t prevent it, and you’ll never stop people from being crappy to each other. Frankly, the way that suit is going, the law won’t stop anyone either.

45. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 2 days, 16 hours, 40 minutes ago

    I’m regurgitating it to illustrate how silly the post that I am parodying is. I did follow up on the story, and I read the .pdf. I made the point (as did other women) that sometimes women are their own worst enemy when claiming they want to be treated equally, and this was just on example thereof. I’m neither sexist, nor angry. This is just a discussion on a website. One, that although you may not agree with the points raised, does not even really rise to the level of rude.

46. Posted by Stephanie - 4 months, 2 days, 16 hours, 37 minutes ago

    I didn’t say that they would be carried out, but you took it upon yourself to say that they were empty threats, hinting that they could or would not be carried out.  I’m not trying to go back and forth, but thats why making threats is illegal; whether its online or not.  Thats why Internet law is a growing field that will continue to grow to address these types of concerns.  It seems that the legal field has you completely jaded. Or maybe you were already like that?

47. Posted by Al Tidom - 4 months, 2 days, 16 hours, 24 minutes ago

    Eddington, what is your problem?  All you do is copy others posts and regurgitate it.  You probably plagiarized your law school papers, if you are even a lawyer at all!  Come up with something original or find somewhere else to stick your fingers.

48. Posted by Jim Eddington - 4 months, 2 days, 16 hours, 1 minute ago

    Yes, Al Tidom, for some of these posts I did copy others posts and regurgitate them. I noted why: to illustrate how silly the post that I am parodying is.

49. Posted by khazeh - 4 months, 1 day, 18 hours, 17 minutes ago

    Jim, if a woman treats those threats as “empty” and then is harmed - guys like you roll their eyes and blather about how “careless” and “stupid” they were for not taking the most basic safety precautions. But you want to use it to riff off how much you hate working with women, feel free.

50. Posted by Kim Lewis - 4 months, 1 day, 15 hours, 36 minutes ago

    From what I read, he said nothing of the sort, nor did he say he hated working with women. Did I miss something??

51. Posted by anon - 4 months, 1 day, 13 hours, 37 minutes ago

    I heard about a campus publication in 1974 that rated men’s sexual performance on a 1-10 scale and reported on the size of their sex organs, time to organism, time to next arousal,  etc.  How would that go over today.

52. Posted by khazeh - 4 months, 1 day, 10 hours, 39 minutes ago

    Yes, Kim, you did. Instead of dealing with the AutoAdmit lawsuit itself, Jim went off on a tangent about how women don’t bill as many hours as men because they’re off with their kids, being their “own worst enemies,“ and on and on. This lawsuit isn’t about billable hours. It’s about ‘anonymous’ Internet posters who stalked a couple of female law students and posted rape and death threats, and are now whining that their ‘free speech’ is hurt because they might have to be responsible for their actions.

    As for Jim’s own-worst-enemy argument, I saw plenty of women in my mother’s generation who behaved exactly as Jim would have liked. They didn’t complain about sexist comments or outright harassment; they didn’t take time off for sick kids (even when the guys were allowed to take time for, say, golf games) ; they put in more hours and worked harder than their male colleagues so they’d be seen as “as good as the men”. Guess what? It didn’t work.

53. Posted by Kim Lewis - 4 months, 1 day, 2 hours, 54 minutes ago

    I re-read it Khazeh, and I think you are badly misinterpreting his position. What he said was that treating people equally means that they are treated the same if they don’t make billable hours regardless of their gender. He said that law suits such as this act as evidence that women can’t actually handle being treated equally. I happen to agree—for some women, this is undoubtedly true, for some it is not. I think you are getting emotionally attached to the discussion and seeing what isn’t there. About your mother’s generation? I’m a woman, and I’m not so naive to think that in the absence of discrimination that exactly 50% of C-level execs, fighter pilots, or managing partners would be women, your ancedote notwithstanding.

54. Posted by Kay Sieverding - 4 months, 21 hours, 45 minutes ago

    The lawsuit alleged defamation and invasion of privacy. There is a group trying to make us give up our established common law rights. One of those is to defend our reputations in court. The anonymous posters need to be identified so that a court trial can proceed. That is consistent with common law rights established over centuries. There is no first amendment right to engage in defamation whether it is anonymous or not anonymous.  Women shouldn’t give up common law rights to defend reputation because then men will be pressured to give up the same common law rights. Then we will end up with substantial numbers of people whose social and economic opportunities are evaded by defamation.  Some publishers want to sell advertising or wield power by publishing defamation. Those publishers have big $ and influence.  I am a victim of defamation. When I attempted to litigate, no facts were established. Then I was assigned to an amorphous group of people without a right to represent myself in court. There were no rule 11 c. 6 orders against me and I don’t have a criminal record.  I turned to blogging to combat defamation but it is very time consuming.

55. Posted by khazeh - 4 months, 17 hours, 18 minutes ago

    Kim, I think you’re letting your fervent agreement with Jim make you emotionally attached to his position. The Yale law students weren’t complaining that a man used the F-word in their presence, or that they were punished for skipping class to attend their kids’ school plays. Their lawsuit is about being stalked, harassed and threatened. Jim, and apparently you, seem to think that if women do not accept rape threats and stalking as part of the cost of being in a “man’s job”, then they bring discrimination on themselves. Can you explain that to me, because I’m sure not following, and I am baffled as to what that has to do with rants about billable hours.

    About your being a woman? The point you’re resolutely refusing to hear is that I observed what happened when women took the “don’t complain, don’t ask for different treatment” advice to heart. It did not, as you would argue, result in equal treatment. You may find it comforting to think that if you just keep your mouth shut and play nice with the boys, that they’ll treat you as an equal. Good luck with that.

56. Posted by Kay Sieverding - 4 months, 16 hours, 37 minutes ago

    My understanding, # 56, is that the lawsuit is about defamation. That their most major concern was how the anonymous postings affected their employability.  The anonymous postings claimed they had herpes and that they did certain. sexual things including having a lesbian affair with a law school employee that they deny.

    Claim VII is “libel” “F 95 One or more defendants published one or more false statements regarding plaintiffs.“ and “F 99 Plaintiffs have suffered injury to their reputations as a result of the false statements”  F 32 “This drumbeat of harassing comments posted about DOE I has caused her severe emotional distress, interfered with her educational progress, and damaged her reputation…DOE I has suffered both actual pecuniary losses and emotional distress”

57. Posted by Barney Google - 4 months, 10 hours, 59 minutes ago

    I think women are entitled to be sensitive on this issue without being persecuted by a few self righteous men who if they were ever in the place of the ladiies would undoubtedly be crapping in their pants!  Congratulations to the ladies for standing up to these little men, and men, try and do better by not persecuting the ladies.  This is exactly what the Yale law school BLOG was all about.

58. Posted by Kim Lewis - 4 months, 1 hour, 51 minutes ago

    I’m not “fervent[ly]“ agreeing with Jim—I said you are misreading his position. I said nothing about accepting threats, being in a man’s job, or bringing discrimination upon oneself. Similarly, I have seen not “rants” about billable hours—he stated that treating people equally in response to their billable hours does not involve basing that treatment on gender. That isn’t a “rant.“ In addition, the fact that you happened to state your opinion concerning the treatment of women doesn’t make it so. And your comments about what you happen to think I “would argue,“ or I would “find comforting” just make you look stupid. You don’t know anything about me, what I think, or anything else, other than the few comments posted here.

59. Posted by H - 3 months, 3 weeks, 4 days, 20 hours, 43 minutes ago

    If some poor little boys can’t stand when women try to fight back when attacked, that shows how much these poor little sensitive boys can stand being treated equally.