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1. Posted by Bo - 1 year, 5 hours, 45 minutes ago

   I do not see why race is such a huge issue.  Why not just reword the article so it states “Large Firms not firing whites fast enough” or “More whites need to go!”

   The ABA is infatuated with race and will do everything it can to harass and denigrate the majority.  Is there a problem with whites holding such positions?  The ABA seems to think so!

2. Posted by gatsby - 1 year, 5 hours, 25 minutes ago

   Well said, Bo. I am so sick of diversity being only about the amount of skin pigmentation in someone’s genetic makeup.

3. Posted by Richard Smith - 1 year, 5 hours, 25 minutes ago

   I assume the ABA recommends racial profiling and racial prejudice in hiring to attain diversity goals.  I thought everyone was to be treated equally under the law.  I guess this does not apply to white males.

4. Posted by kosmo - 1 year, 4 hours, 56 minutes ago

   From the comments above, it is very obvious why diversity is needed in the legal profession.  That white males would feel that they are somehow “disadvantaged” by an attempt to open the doors to the long unbalanced “playing field” is disingenuous.  These comments exemplify the xenophobic, bigoted and misogynistic attitudes that permaates legal community today. Shame on you!

5. Posted by Ingrid - 1 year, 4 hours, 42 minutes ago

   I think that it is because of people like you who would prefer to hide their heads in the sand and pretend that diversity in the legal profession is not a problem that the problem is so pervasive. What is also sad is that people like you bring those attitudes with you when become members of hiring committtees.  I would like to point out that diversity is not only about pigmentation. It is about race, gender, sexual orientation and all the things that make people different. Why should the diversity that is so much a part of society not be reflected in the profession. I think that it speaks to a firm’s ability to truly understand and represent it’s clients when it can offer advice based on diverse experiences.

6. Posted by Over it - 1 year, 4 hours, 28 minutes ago

   Clearly, Bo, Gatsby and Richard Smith are employed at Herrick Feinstein, Blank Rome, Pryor Cashman, or Paul Hastings.  Enough said.  I too would be defensive if my firm was called out like that!

7. Posted by Erick Diaz - 1 year, 4 hours, 25 minutes ago

   Well said Ingrid and kosmo!

   Richard Smith, I respect your position.  I also respect the fact that you added your name to your post, which is more than I can say about gatsby and Bo.

8. Posted by R - 1 year, 4 hours, 7 minutes ago

   This white hetero male says “Well said, Ingrid.”

9. Posted by Paul Perez - 1 year, 3 hours, 18 minutes ago

   I’ve worked for organizations where there was little diversity and where diversity was employed in every aspect of how it was run.  In my experience, lack of diversity gives you single minded ideas and decisions, while diversity allows for discourse based on many experiences.  Ultimately, the result is a more thought out and well rounded idea, solution, etc.

   There isn’t a problem with the majority holding such positions, however, firms would be better served by allowing and encouraging minorities to fill these positions as well.  Race and color aren’t the only means of diversity, but it is the most apparent form of diversity and easiest to implement.

10. Posted by Craig - 1 year, 1 hour, 51 minutes ago

    Diversity is important because we live in a diverse society.  For many years, doors were shut to minoirities.  Some in the majority would prefer things this way because they are somehow confused and believe that if one black, hispanic, or Asian person makes partner, that they are somehow taking a position that should have been theirs.  This is illogical based upon the fact that people who look like them make up 80 to 90% of the partners in the firm. 

    That said, if a white person is well-qualified for a position, they are very likely to have the opporunity to get the position.  This is because the vast majority of the decision-makers look like them and are comfortable with people who are similar.  What I have found is that many of the white people who complain about diversity are the ones who are underachievers and who are upset that the “white privilege” has been slightly diminished.  This means that they may actually have to be well-qualified to get a job that previously may have been awarded to them based upon meeting minimum requirements and being white.

    If you can’t make partner or you can’t get a good job and you are white, it is likely because you have done enough to meet the most minimum of standards.  Contrast that to being a minoirty where you will most likely have to be over-qualified to get the same opportunity.

    Stop complaining about minorities taking one or two jobs and focus on improving your performance, education, and other credentials.  If you do this, then doors will fly open and you will have the opportunity to take full advantage of your “white privilege.”

11. Posted by Chauncey - 1 year, 30 minutes ago

    I would agree with the majority of the previous posts up to this point, particularly Craig who posted ideas similar to those of mine before I could put them in writing.  Views like those expressed by Bo, Gatsby, and Richard Smith exemplify the need for entities like the ABA to bring attention to the problem of diversity in the legal profession.  Instead of being threatened by the attention given to diversity, people like those against it should step their game up to ensure they do not become obsolete, which those like Bo, Gatsby, and Richard are obviously afraid of.  The world we live in encourages competition.  In fact, many notable economists over the years as well as the Federal Government have noted that increased competition encourages everyone to perform at peak levels.  Competition ensures that everyone strives for excellence instead of settling for mediocrity.  As Craig mentioned before I could post this comment, stop focusing on who else may get hired and just make sure that you are well-qualified for the position you seek.  While I realize this means many white males can no longer rely solely on their outward appearance to get the positions they may want, it ensures that those getting the position are well-qualified for it, which goes for minorities as well as whites.

    My charge to those like Bo, Gatsby, and Richard Smith is to rise to the positive challenge presented by increased diversity in the profession.  Contrary to what Bo contends, no one is insisting that you be fired unless, of course, you deserve to be.  Instead, those who support diversity are asking you to get up and prove you are competent to do the job you have or want; embrace the fact that differences ensure effective collaboration; realize that monopolies are not good for anyone, even the one doing the monopolizing; learn from and share experiences with those who come from different walks of life in an effort to broaden your own individual perspective; and most importantly, advance the goals of the profession, not just your own, to ensure it remains a profession that is respected, coveted, and sought out by all who have something to positively contribute to it.

    As for gatsby’s comment on “pigmentation,” I will not entertain it beyond saying that you epitomize the need for diversity in OUR profession.  Do yourself a favor and find the nearest minority you can find or another individual of your same race with a broader perspective on life and learn something from him or HER because you are seriously lacking on the subject matter.

12. Posted by silver surfer - 11 months, 4 weeks, 2 days, 9 hours, 38 minutes ago

    My blood boils when even a report on the low representation of minorities in New York law firms generates the protests of Bo, Gatsby and Smith.  Never has the fear of so few presented such a slow-moving threat to so many. Are the first three comments all from “endangered” white lawyers in big white law firms or firm rejects still thinking that their exclusion from the club was due to an affimative allocation of the last 3 associate slots to “unqualified” minorities??? Hug a black person and get over yourself!!!

13. Posted by Chris DeAnda - 11 months, 4 weeks, 2 days, 6 hours, 29 minutes ago

    I am astonished by some of the comments on a site such as the ABA’s site. Why are people so scared of people that are different than themselves? I embrace people that are different just because of what I have learned from them and taught them.

    When I was in the military, I met a lot of people that were fearful of someone different than them moving above them in rank. After speaking to these “fearful” individuals, I let them know that they had to step up no matter what in order to keep the priviledges that they had. I think that lots of people get complacent with themselves. The reality of it all is that no one can get complacent especially in a leadership position.

    Are we going to accept the 21st century or are we going to stay back in the past? Like it or not, diversity needs to be implemented. I hate hearing things like “We have A black guy that works with us.” If you can count the number of minorities in your organization, then there are not enough in your organization.

14. Posted by J.D. - 11 months, 4 weeks, 2 days, 1 hour, 55 minutes ago

    YOU MISSED THE POINT OF THE FIRST POSTERS.

    No one is “fearful” of diversity. No one is saying that “firms should be all white.”

    The concern is that the ABA and similar leftist organizations are more infatuated with skin color than the KKK. Who cares what a person looks like? I was taught in kindergarten that a person’s race means nothing—it’s what’s on the inside that counts.

    And most of the leftist posters here seem to think that “white people” bring no diversity to the table. WRONG. There is more diversity amongst 10 white people then there is amongst 10 black people.

    WHY? Because a random sampling of whites will give you 5 democrats, and 5 republicans—and everything that comes along with that political posturing (ie. a multitude of opinion). And whites might be Irish, Italian, Australian, Swedish, Canadian, etc. To suggest that an all-white firm has no diversity is completely ignorant.

    A random sampling of blacks will give you about 9.5 democrats, and therefor less diversity of opinion.

    TAKE A DEEP BREATH. Now no one is suggesting that racial harmony isn’t wanted by all. That would be great. But the phrase from the poster above—“diversity needs to be implemented”—is frightening in that it requires everyone to be placed into a box. We all have to declare a race, a skin color, a sexual orientation, etc. Hitler was in the business of categorizing people by physical appearance.

    How can we ever get to Martin Luther King, Jr.’s “colorblind society” if we’re constantly focused on color?

    MLK, Jr. is rolling over in his grave.

15. Posted by J.D. - 11 months, 4 weeks, 2 days, 1 hour, 46 minutes ago

    AND another thing. NOT all whites are wealthy elitists like Kennedy and Bush. Most of us have worked our butts off to get where we are. Remember, there are more poverty-stricken whites in this country than there are any other poverty-stricken people. So when Affirmative Action automatically assumes that whites aren’t in need, it’s just racist stereotyping and sad.

    My black roommate in college was just like me academically, but his parents were a heart surgeon and a lawyer. My white parents work at a grade school and in construction.

    But when we both applied to law school, guess who got the bonus points based on a faulty assumption?

    Affirmative Action perpetuates stereotypes. And all those who support it buy into the falsehoods. And they tend to be the most racist people out there.

16. Posted by Jonny - 11 months, 4 weeks, 2 days, 1 hour, 30 minutes ago

    What advocates of Affirmative Action don’t realize is that poor whites have to compete with BOTH wealthy, well-connected whites (who get into law school because their daddy made a phone call) AND with minorities (who automatically get bonus points because of their appearance).

    The whites upset about articles like this are the remaining people unable to benefit from some unfair boost.

    And it continues once you get to law school: well-connected whites get jobs from their daddy’s friends and minorities have job fairs crafted just for them. Firms fall over each other desperately trying to hire anyone who will add pigment to their office.

    The unconnected white is left to fend for himself.

    And those are the whites upset with articles like this.

17. Posted by James - 11 months, 4 weeks, 1 day, 14 hours, 25 minutes ago

    I was amused by JD’s post.  It started of like there may be something intellectually stimulating in it but once I read the statement “There is more diversity amongst 10 white people then there is amongst 10 black people.” I realized a disservice was done either to or in the kinderggarten he referred to with fondness.

    There is an issue with diversity that needs to be addressed even beyond the legal profession that surpasses race, religion, sex, gender, etc.  Race and gender are obvious because no questions need be asked.  For political inclination, you mostly have engaged in conversation and expressed it.

18. Posted by TJ - 11 months, 4 weeks, 1 day, 11 hours, 36 minutes ago

    JD’s comment was not amusing, it was ignorant. 

    You speak of diversity of political affiliation with race as an indicator; however, economics are the true indicator.  In the same breath you mention the geographical diversity of whites, but what you fail to realize (since you’ve probably never met a black person or spoken to the black nanny that you are likely employ) is that there is just as much geographic diversity among blacks, whether it’s the many many islands of the Caribbean, the UK, the many many countries of Africa (which is a continent remember), the many many countries of South America (that’s a continent also remember), and yes, even Canada. 

    This lack of diversity among blacks is due to the entire race being dragged here and stripped of their identity, religion, name and dignity.  The lack of diversity can be attributed to not ever knowing where one truly originated.  How lucky are whites that they can trace their heritage and claim their roots.  Again, white priviledge.

    Finally, people need to wake up and smell the coffee.  Diversity is not all about race.  It’s about geographic diversity (firms love to say they have associates from all parts of the glove), it’s about gender (women have been disadvantaged due to archaic notions of their proper place in society), it’s about sexual orientation (something that many bigots also choose to ignore).  What diversity is not about is the white privilege that allows the white male partner to bring in his white male nephew, uncle and son into the roles that others are deserving of.  The sad thing is that this happens at all levels, from private high schools to law schools to the firms.  People complain about blacks and others stealing spots; however, white privilege decreases the number of available spots at the outset.

    Stop complaining, get a clue and take solice that as a white male, you’ve got a couple hundred years of a head start.  Women and others are just playing catch up!

19. Posted by J.D. - 11 months, 4 weeks, 1 day, 8 hours ago

    GUESS WHAT? I agree with both posters above (even though they called me names).

    James is correct in noting that diversity “surpasses race, religion, sex, gender, etc.” That was MY point. You can have ALL SORTS of diversity amongst people who look the same. We DO need to look deeper than skin deep. Giving a person bonus points on an application because they checked a box doesn’t allow for a very deep look.

    But when James says, “Race and gender are obvious because no questions need be asked,” he is inferring that a person’s physical appearance automatically MEANS something. Actually, one does need to ask more questions to know anything about the individual (i.e. whether they need help getting into law school OR whether their dad is partner in the biggest firm in N.Y.). You can’t assume a person’s physical appearance can give you that answer. To assume otherwise is racist and stereotyping.

    As for TJ, well he is also correct in many areas EVEN THOUGH he ignorantly stereotyped me—no, TJ, just because I’m white doesn’t mean I don’t clean my own house. It’s amusing he says that right after arguing that it’s economic diversity that matters! Guess what: there are millions of poor whites in this country, many of whom are maids and nannies! But I guess that doesn’t fit your stereotypical vision of the world.

    Still, TJ I agree with you in the sense that the term “black” doesn’t mean anything more than the term “white.” There is TONS of diversity amongst both groups. But again, when it comes to studies like the one this article is based on, or applications for law school or jobs, individuals are given (or not given) points based on a simple check of a box that doesn’t allow any of this diversity to be recognized.

    Again, you can have tons of diversity amongst 10 white people (or 10 black people), but under this study, neither group would be diverse because the only indicator of diversity to most is skin color. That’s just plain wrong.

    Finally, TJ is right in that “people complain about blacks stealing spots” AND that “white privilege decreases the number of available spots at the outset.” This is why both minorities AND wealthy white boys are usually supportive or indifferent on the issue of Affirmative Action. It’s the middle class white boy or poor whitey that is screwed by BOTH white privilege and Affirmative Action. A poor white boy from the Ozarks can’t call his dad to get him into a Manhattan law firm, nor can he can’t take advantage of an artificial social program. And those are the people most upset. READ Jonny’s post above; I think it sums it up nicely.

    WE CAN ALL COME TOGETHER on a program that is based on economic need. It doesn’t divide us by race, doesn’t require us to declare our skin color and sex life to potential employers, and it is not going to help out people who don’t need help. And in that sense, TJ is right on.

20. Posted by anonymous - 11 months, 3 weeks, 6 days, 11 hours, 14 minutes ago

    In response to one of JD’s postings, there are actually more poverty-stricken Native Americans than in any ethnic/racial group in the United States, based on the percentage of the total population of that ethnic group that lives below the poverty line.  And, yet, notice that Native Americans were not included in the discussion of minorities or the disadvantaged at all—as if we did not exist.  If one is going to speak of increasing diversity or being stripped of identity, religion, name and dignity, it is imperative to remember that Natives should be included and that repression first happened to the indigenous population before it happened to anyone else in this country.

21. Posted by J.D. - 11 months, 3 weeks, 5 days, 8 hours, 21 minutes ago

    Just to clarify, I was talking in total numbers. There are more poor whites in this country than there are poor people of any other color. Unfortunately, Affirmative Action advocates (and the program itself) make use of racist stereotyping in concluding that whites are all well-connected and wealthy and that all blacks are poor and in need of a social program to get ahead.

    I can’t buy into that racialist generalizing.

    And I agree with you fully, Anonymous, on the need for greater opportunities for Native Americans.

    Again, we need more opportunities for poor people of ALL COLORS!

    It’s time to stop focusing on our physical appearances.

22. Posted by Nan - 11 months, 3 weeks, 5 days, 2 hours, 10 minutes ago

    Comparing the ABA to the KKK and or to Hitler is truly pathetic and clearly demonstrates the inability of some individuals to fully grasp the issue that is gently cloaked in the word “diversity”. The ABA deserves a purple heart for its tireless efforts in trying to diplomatically bring an end the bias and bigotry that continues to stain and soil the profession.
    Diversity of course includes physical and non-physical attributes and characteristics. The ABA rightly observes, however, that minorities still are not fairly represented in large law firms.
    The token window dressing simply does not cut it!  I, for one, hope the naming of names (names of law firms) continues.

23. Posted by ld - 11 months, 2 weeks, 5 days, 7 hours, 54 minutes ago

    Can we please recall that white women (as in - those white women I’m sure many of the initial posters plan to wed) are the primary, PRIMARY benefactors of affirmative action. Aside from the fact that white privilege is *priceless* - whites generally receive the same “affirmative action” when they apply to predominantly minority institutions - HBCU’s are one clear example.